" Being John Molo "
Get inside the head of Phil's most Phrequent Phriend

Could you tell us a bit about your musical beginnings?

Yeah sure. I was born in Bethesda, Maryland in 1953 at Our Lady of Lords Hospital, and I was the son of an Oceanographer & Meteorologist and my mother was a housewife. There was a lot of music around my house and there was a lot of music around the DC community. It's an interesting area. It's south of the Mason-Dixon Line. It's really a southern city. If you turn your radio dial down to the left hand side on the FM station, you get what that area's about. It's about Gospel, R&B and Appalachian music meeting one another.

When I hear those three types of music I just feel like I'm at home. I think it's fairly rare. I don't meet a lot of people who are as touched by Luther Vandross as they are by Ricky Scaggs. So anyway I had kind of a unique upbringing in DC. I loved music from the time I was a little kid. I heard "Little Ricky" on the I Love Lucy show playing drums and I loved it. My Dad used to take us to Andrew's Airforce Base and they had the Navy Band Cats, so to speak, and they'd play Jazz/Dance music. I remember watching the band. I loved the lights and the way the band sounded, but I particularly loved the drums and the way they looked. I'd watch the drummer and see the upright bass standing up there and think, "That is really cool, but I can't really hear it like I hear those drums." It just hit me like scripture hits [Jerry] Fallwell. [laughs] It just got me somehow. I liked the way it looked and I loved the way it sounded.

I had a really nice Aunt send me these toy drums with cowboys and Hawaiian dancers on the front [laughter] - you know, 5 or 6 years old. I just had a really nice kind of "Ozzie and Harriet" upbringing. It was really nice, and lots of music somehow just seeped into our scene. The other thing is that I went to Catholic school in Washington, DC. You always hear stories of nuns doing crazy things to kids, but we had these nuns - I think they were the Order of Notre Dame, and there's different orders - but these were musical nuns. They had us singing in Latin, hymns, traditional religious tunes, as well as some Americana stuff … [begins singing "Turkey in the Straw"]

'Now all join in and form a big ring/
We like the music it makes us sing/
So come along and sing a song/
Because a Turkey in the Straw is a good old melody.'
(laughter and applause)

Oh man! Now that's not so easy for a bunch of fifth-graders singing that, you know. (laughs)

Were you playing drums with that too? (laughs)

I was in my mind at the time actually! [laughter] Absolutely! So anyway we had a really cool environment. One time we were singing in Latin in class and I got the part right, with 3 part harmonies - I can't believe we were doing that stuff. One of the nuns came up to me and said, "Johnny, you got that part right! Come up and sing in front of the class." So she thought I was going to come up and sing this Latin piece and I got up there and just started singing "Bingo!" - the song about the dog. [laughter] [Begins to sing… "and Bingo was his name-o"] The class just went nuts! I remember that I had done something wrong, but it was funny to me. It wasn't like "Uh, I made this terrible mistake." It was just such a cool musical environment.

Billy Payne, the keyboard player from Little Feat, said to me this one time - we were going over some vocals - and I said,
"I think the part is this…" and he said, "You know, you've got those good church ears." So I had a very unique upbringing. I had: church, hymnal, R&B, Appalachian and I had parents that loved music. Then I went to a High School with a music program that was just excellent. There was a principal named Elam Hertzler at Langley High School in right next to the CIA in McClain, Virginia. This guy wanted to de-emphasize the Sports programs and emphasize Arts, Music, Drama and Academics. It was brilliant. People have asked me, "Wow, did any other kids in your music program in High School go into the music business?" I said, "I think that whole sax section went to the Ivy League. Man, they were smart!" They read music and we played a Jazz Band Lab class. It was a regular class that was taken seriously and our music director in high school, God Bless his soul, George Horan, right along with the principal who de-emphasized the athletics and emphasized the Arts, said, "We are not marching for any football team at half-time. We are a serious Music program and we're not providing any entertainment in stupid suits." He didn't say it that way - but that's what he meant.

More like a Jazz Ensemble?

Well, we started off with Reserve Band, which we called "Reverse Band" - that was for the starters, then Symphonic Band, then Stage Band after school. We would compete against these schools like, Bethesda, Chevy Chase, Oakden High School and a few schools from the inner city in DC. Man, it was a beautiful scene. They would broadcast it on WMAL in Washington late at night. You know it was a big deal to be on the radio. Music was emphasized and taken seriously. Like I said, most of the guys went to college - to Ivy League schools or MIT. I mean these guys were smart and it showed me something too. Music is an important part of education. I mean the amount of money they spend on athletic tape as opposed to the amount of money they put in to the Arts - but that's another subject.

I was lucky to go to a school where they were serious about drama and music and it was a regular public high school. That sent me in the right direction. So, I was thinking I wanted to go to college. I was kind of this preppy kid and I didn't have great grades but >>>>video<<<< my High School teacher George Horan, the guy who ran the music department said, "Man, why don't you check out the University of Miami." I was thinking about North Texas and Berkeley and he says, "You ought to check out Miami." We had two kids that went down there a couple of years before me and they liked it. So in 1973 I headed down to Miami to start college. I had taken a year off after high school and played some clubs in DC with a great piano player named Wade Beach. I just thought I was a great player and I was going to go down there and take over.

I walked into the rehearsal room and the Big Band was playing. Not only were they good, they had a rhythm section that was Pat Metheny, Danny Gotlieb on drums, Mark Egan and Mike Gerber on piano. It was so good. I didn't even know what their approach was. It was this contemporary ECM thing that they had going on. So I stepped into the University of Miami and guitarist Hiram Bullock, Steve Watson - the great sessions guitarist from Los Angeles, and Steve Morse from The Dreggs were all down there. Pat Metheny started a program down there and the teachers were talking about getting gigs. By the time Steve Morse had left the University changed the focus of the program to getting record deals. They changed the consciousness.

Wow! How long were those guys there at that point when you came in?

You know, I can't remember for sure. Pat was there for a short amount of time - maybe a year or so - and then he went up to Boston and did that record with Bobby Moses and Jaco [Pastorius] which was a phenomenal record. By the way, Jaco was down there at the University while I was there and I knew him just a little bit. He was a very creative guy. He was actually a really good drummer. He showed me a couple of licks on drums. So Jaco was down there and Bobby Watson (Robert as we used to call him), the alto player from Kansas City, Curtis Lundy, Carmen Lundy, as I said the Dreggs, Steve Morse was there maybe for the whole four years - but he was going to get a record deal straight out of school. He had a vision.

Anyway, it kind of turned our heads on what we were going to do musically. So, I also met a piano player down there named Bruce Hornsby and he was a really interesting guy. Bruce and I had a number of things in common, both ex-jocks, both from the Commonwealth of Virginia and both about 6'3". I joke with people when they ask, "Are you and Bruce both competitive guys?" I say, "Well, the first time we met each other, the first thing we did was measure each other to see which one was taller." [laughter]

Yeah, I always thought the two of you would have been a good basketball pick-up team. [laughter]

Well that's another thing… we spent many hours playing basketball. [SEE REALVIDEO STREAM (DL)]: One of the things I miss about hanging out with Bruce - you know I always loved his music - is playing basketball with him. He's such a good player. He's a ball to play with. But anyway, I met Bruce down there. He was a different guy then. He had on a white t-shirt and white painters pants, and these black low-top Converse all-stars - I think he had 'em on for about three weeks one time. He completely shaved his head and he had these big, kinda goofy coke-bottle glasses and I just loved him, man (laughs) - just walking around there - he just did not give a damn! (laughs)

So, I met this guy down there and maybe we were in the second or third band - I can't remember - but Bruce didn't really sing down there and it wasn't until later that I found out he could sing - and that he was a very good singer. Anyway, I met him down there and I met my wife down there. University of Miami was a good thing for me. I've just kind of found a course in the music business or just kind of access to the main stream in the right way. I don't know how I've done it - I guess just by listening to a few people along the way.

Cheers!

After I got out of Miami I said to Bruce, "If you ever get a band together over the summer I'm going to be in DC for a couple of years… I don't think I'll go to New York - I think I'd get my butt kicked there - but if you ever need a drummer, call me." Then he called me and we stared playing in '78. We played for a couple of years in Virginia. In 1980, Steve Watson, Bruce and myself headed out to the West Coast and tried to make our way here in the big city [Los Angeles].

So who comprised the band in '78?

Well, Bruce, myself, Bruce's brother, Bobby Hornsby played bass, his wife, Anne sang, and we had this guitar player. We go down there and do a few gigs and I'm into bee-bop and everything and Bobby Hornsby's the first good musician I've met that's really into this band, The Grateful Dead. I had seen the Dead in 1972 at American University - they had one drummer at the time - I think Billy... I remember going there and thinking, hey, these guys are kinda cool. But I especially remember that the framework was really cool. The vibe - we didn't use that word back then - but just the scene - it was a bit of a happening maybe… So I kinda knew of them and I found out later that was kinda a cool show - AU. I didn't think much about them - I knew a couple of tunes.

So then here comes Bobby Hornsby, this bass player in this band I was gonna play with, and he really likes the Dead and thinks Phil Lesh is it! So, I'm like, ok, cool, ya know… So we would do a few tunes with Bruce Hornsby and Bruce was into the Dead too - he liked the songwriting and the improvisational side, but Bobby was more of a head - his volleyball team in college used to paint their faces up and go play - kinda the Deadhead fraternity. He had this bass playing style and he really had Phil down. So once again, my road through the music business is really interesting. Anyway, I started playing with those guys and I went to a couple of Dead shows with them - the Mosque in '78, then William and Mary in maybe '79. Then I moved to LA in 1980 and tried to make it as a session player out here and really didn't succeed very much. I did a few TV shows - Hillstreet Blues and Hardcastle and McCormick with this guy Mike Post. I did a few demos and Bruce was out here. I think he was a staff writer at 20th Century for a while and he was kinda scuffling. Steve Watson, the guitarist, did well - he could read really well, and he could play great solos, and play great parts. He did a lot of TV stuff. So we were out here, just sort of paying our dues I guess.

In about 1985, we were at Burbank Blvd. and Sepulveda and we were getting on the 405 and Bruce said to me, "Man, I think I'm gonna get a deal. Would you, like, go out for not much money? Is that something you'd think about or would that be too tough?" And I was like, "Bro, I'm down! I'm down with a record deal." It just seemed like the coolest thing I ever heard of. [SEE REALVIDEO STREAM (DL)]: So he put this record out, 'The Way It Is', and it just blew up and we went over to London and made a video and they had us in a lot of makeup - man, we look really funny now if you see us…

Yeah, it hit first in Europe?

Yeah, in the UK, then Holland. We went over there and did a bunch of crazy TV shows - just these kids TV shows - and finally I think Bruce just finally went, "Wait a minute. What am I doing? I'm the artist and I can't be doing this…" So it was a funny process, ya know, we were kinda growing up together and goin', "Oh right, yeah…" If you ever see 'The Way It Is' video, Bruce (laughs), gosh the two of us look like we're gonna go out on a date together (laughs) - we've got so much makeup on. I have this white cotton shirt and suspenders and this Harrison Ford hat. I looked weird! George Michael had on a real similar outfit - not the Wham video, but a later one (laughs), and Bruce has on this white silky kind of shirt. Originally they had it with all these strange characters in it like they kind of did an interpretation of the tune 'The Way It Is'. They had kind of an English looking guy - a combination of J.R. from the show Dallas and Boss Hog from the Dukes of Hazard. [laughter] I'd love to see it now - it's probably great. I remember Bruce and I looking at it and thinking, "They don't even look like anyone we know." They looked completely foreign to us. (laughs)

So anyway, we got that video back to performance and that was the start of a great thing. When I listen to the tapes now, we're a little bit more Pop-ie in our approach. We hadn't really started to jam and stretch at that point.

Being that you guys had just gotten into the Dead, did you ever discuss their music or approach?

No. It was just sort of a thing that we'd discuss in general. Like, Wow… that's interesting. Bruce would go, "You know they've got some good tunes" and I would say, "Well, I like the way they jam. They don't always hit it but they've got something going on there." Yeah, The Range was pretty happening. We only had ten tunes and we had a lot of gigs so we did a couple of covers. One of the covers that we did was "I Know You Rider" - Bruce may correct me on this - and they found out about it and we opened a few shows for the Dead [in May 1987]. It was unbelievable. I was out there talking to Mickey and Jim Keltner was out there on stage playing with Ry Cooder. Jim told me a shocking thing he said, "You know, you remind me of the great drummer Jim Gordon" …and for all of you people who know who Jim Gordon is AHH! [Molo shrieks] Jim was a really good drummer.

That's a tremendous compliment.

Oh, absolutely! Of course I didn't figure that immediately. It was just a really great time and I just felt great about being in the music business. We were cruising along with Bruce Hornsby and The Range until about 1990 when Brent [Mydland] passed away. They called Bruce up and asked if he could do some stuff for them. Then we really started talking about the Dead a lot. Bruce had a band, and a career.

Did you go to see the Dead then?

Yeah! We went to see them a couple of times. Bruce ended going, "You know I like this thing and I want to do it." I was encouraging…

Was that hard on the band?

For a couple of guys it was a little weird.

[SEE REALVIDEO STREAM (DL)]: For me no. I was like, "Go ahead and do it man." I had had a bit of an epiphany. We had opened for the Dead at RFK and played for about 8,000 people and then the Dead came out and there were about 55,000 [laughs] and I came down the ramp at RFK where the Redskins played, and the Senators used to play, and where I had seen Mickey Mantle hit a homerun out of there… so anyway, I'm walking down the ramp and look up on the big screen and there's Bruce up there playing his accordion with Garcia.

Bruce is playing and Jerry's playing and it looks like they're just going, "HEY MAN!… HEY MAN!" [laughter] and it was beautiful. I just thought, "You know we could open for the Dead as Bruce Hornsby and The Range a thousand times but just seeing Bruce up there on the big screen with Jerry, I mean that was it! That was the moment for me when I just said, "You know, you should just go and play with them." [laughter] I think it was just a moment where I had walked down and had the right combination of music and fragrances and it was RFK and it was swirling all around and I looked up on the big screen and there's Brucie with Jerry. I just went "YEAH!" I knew it meant something to Bruce too - I could just see the expression on his face. Anyway, through Bruce going out there and playing with them, I saw a lot more of the Dead.

Did he bring any of that back to the band?

Yeah, he sure did man! We started jamming a lot more.

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"Being John Molo" - Conducted by B.Heisler & R.Lucente
October 30, 2000 - LA, CA. Foreword by L.Tafro.
© 2001. All rights reserved.
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